http://extremelongevity.net/wp-cont...-death.pdf

Wondering what people have to say about this. The study showed a decrease in lifespan in mice taking fish oil relative to mice taking safflower oil, which is rich in omega-6 PUFAs.

I can tell you this a lot of studies are poorly done. Mice are herbivores, they don't consume animal proteins or fats. This can be why they lived a shorter lifespan. Also take note that safflower oil is a plant based fat.

Well, I too am somewhat sceptical at the requirement to eat more fish oil than what anyone realistically could expect to get as part of a normal diet, with the exception of (possibly) a pre globalisation era fish loving Japanese, or Eskimo...
It does not seem very natural. I DO believe fish oil in realistic doses is healthy, but my sister who is a Dr said it's dangerous to OD on fish oil and was very shocked that I was taking 14 capsules of a certain brand, rather than the 1-2 capsules that are recommended on the bottle
However I was just sick in an inflammatory disease which I am desperate to control so I do not end up indefinitely on cortisone..... So I am taking the chance. So far so good.

I did not look at the study in question, but you really have to scrutinize everything you see on the internet, who did the study, who paid for it, and whether there is some form of financial gain by releasing the results. Also, ONE study does not prove anything. Multiple studies need to be done.

And, let's consider what fish oil does for humans by looking at populations that naturally consume high amounts of fish. Their longevity is impressive.

While I do also question the recommendation to take so much fish oil, I still do it and have had positive results.

I think it is important to mention. The amount of Fish Oil an individual takes daily is often specific. There are many studies that show ( see Dr Sears book, "The OmegaRX Zone" ) varying amounts of fish oil gm used as it relates to the imflammation being addressed.

Most Important is that your AA/EPA ratios do not drop below 1.5

Hi Hannah. There has never been, as far as I know, in any of the fish oil literature that exists out there, any reports of people dying from too much fish oil, etc.

Negative side effects, yes. But nobody has died from fish oil.

(and my knowledge is not the greatest, but I did read a lot of Dr. Sears' books),

Sarah

Decreasing your intake of Omega-6 will help out immensely, so that is a great step. Blood tests would probably show a better picture, but the reduction of Omega-6 changes some of the ratios, and overall you would require less EPA/DHA.

I'm more concerned about this now. See: http://www.crcnetbase.com/doi/abs/1...13003-c19. Apparently degree of membrane unsaturation predicts lifespan in other mammals, which implies that if it possible to increase membrane unsaturation using supplemental DHA you might be accelerating the aging process. Many people I've talked to who are unfamiliar with the zone paradigm abut are interested in extending healthy lifespan as long as possible have tried to minimize dietary DHA in response. I'd like to hear what Dr. Sears has to say in response to this emerging information.

Craig

I have your questions and will research and get back to you.

I am curious, too.
While researching and posting on whether there are any additional benefits to cooking or not cooking Egg Whites, the same source noted a harmful effect of DHA, as well.
Waiting for a definitive answer . . .

Here is what I have gathered . Based on some recent posting I guess I need to say that Tech-Support confirms and consult with the same individual who handles "Ask Dr Sears" inquiries if I am stuck. Bottom line the information source is the same.

Too much DHA (a polyunsaturated fat) may lead to oxidation in the cellular and mitochondrial membranes, it’s this process that may be accelerating aging. Cells that are less prone to oxidation will function better and we may age slower. The solution?
Always supplement your omega 3’s with a high quality polyphenol product. Zone Labs suggests that for every 2.5g/d of EPA/DHA one should supplement with a minimum of 8.000 ORAC units. All of our polyphenol products contain 8,000 ORAC units per serving. Information on polyphenols are at these links:
http://www.zonediet.com/polyphenols
http://blog.zonehealth.com/2011/02/...lyphenols/
http://blog.zonehealth.com/2011/01/the-secret-of-blueberries-it%e2%80%99s-the-dephinidins/
http://www.zonediet.com/0/zonediet/new-zone-polyphenols-rx-and-polyphenols-xt

Remember the brain needs both EPA and DHA and in the optimal ratio. Dr. Sears believes a 2:1 ratio is ideal. Eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) is an essential fatty acid, one of several omega-3 fatty acids.. EFAs are essential to human health but cannot be made in the body.. The typical Western diet is relatively deficient in omega-3 fatty acids compared to the diets of our ancestors. OmegaRx will raise the concentrations of EPA in the body. Increased intake of EPA has been shown to be beneficial in coronary heart disease, high blood pressure, and inflammatory disorders such as rheumatoid arthritis. How? Because EPA inhibits the activity of certain enzymes (delta 5 desaturase) that make arachidonic acid the building block of “bad” hormones.

Docosahexaenoic acid (DHA) is an omega-3 fatty acid that is critical for proper brain function, for the development of our nervous system and visual abilities. Low levels have also been associated with ADHA, depression and Alzheimer's disease in adults. Our bodies naturally produce some DHA, but in amounts too small and irregular to ensure proper biochemical functioning. Therefore, DHA must be consumed in the diet through foods such as cold water fatty fish or in supplement form in order to assure an adequate supply.

One of the best indicators of the aging process is the AA/EPA ratio (http://drsears.com/ArticlePreview/tabid/399/itemid/68/Default.aspx).

And on THAT note, today I received this month's issue of the Life Extension magazine.
One of the articles is entitled, "Groundbreaking Study Reveals New Mechanism Behind FISH OIL'S HEALTH BENEFITS".
Aside from the previously known health benefits, which Dr. Sears wrote and 'discovered' long before most media,
the article reveals through new studies, additional benefits of both EPA and DHA.
.
As the article states, "The landmark study not only confirms that the components in Fish Oil not only stops inflammation, and also helps to actively treat any current existing inflammation - BUT, even better than that, the researchers discovered the secret behind fish oil's super-nutrient status!"
.
"Researchers at the University of California - San Diego have published a 'groundbreaking' study as to HOW fish oil works inside a cell to produce its anti-inflammatory effects".
.
"Essentially they found that Omega=3's produce specialized pro-resolution molecules. These resolvins and protectins are directly formed from the Omega-3 atty acids eocosapentaenoic acid EPA and docoaahexaenoic acid (DHA). Interestingly, beneficial lipoxins are formed from arachidonic acid (AA), but require high omega-3 concentrations for their production."
.
So much so, that, "Big Pharma (just like they tried with Omega-3) wants to modify these molecules, patent them, and sell them for huge mark-ups."
But by simple supplementing with their precursors, the EPA and DHA in Fish Oil, you'll be giving your body what it needs."
.
Its a rather lengthy article, and it goes on to state what we've know from Dr. Sears, and what most officials, now know and have accepted, that by, "doing so (taking high doses of Omega-3 like we do on the ZONE), you can directly impact some of the most common diseases of aging by battling age-induced inflammation."
.
Though it is a very enlightening article, it raises another qustion, in that it directly implies that AA, or at least some AA, it does not state anything further, is beneficial? If so, how much? I would state that possibly though Dr. Sears did not know the exact details or reasons, hit upon it by specifying the ideal AA/EPA ratio. Which, according to this article, means one does NOT want to eliminate AA completely, even if one could, which we can not.
What the study does do, and as the article directly implies, is that both EPA and DHA are both beneficial, which also goes back to Dr. Sears statements about the ratio being 2:1. Which would counter any of the possible negatives of too much? Of course that's just ne talking ...

It's all about the axis, the balance, of AA/EPA, as Barry Sears has explained so well in several of his books.

Tech Support - I'm writing to ask about the number of ORAC units recommended when taking fish oil. I've recently upped my OmegaRX dose to 1 TBS per day. Is the standard 2 oz dose of Sea Health Plus enough? Thanks.

Larry, you'll need 3 standard 1 oz. doses SHP (that's 3 capfuls, or 6 Tbsp., per 1 oz. dose) for 1 Tbsp Omega Rx. Dr. Sears recommendation is one 1 oz dose SHP for every 2.5 g (EPA plus DHA) of Omega Rx.

Thanks, Sue - what if I continued the 1 oz of Sea Health Plus and added 2 capsules of Polyphenols Plus? Would that work? It's less expensive.

Depends on what you mean by "work". You'll be getting polyphenols, but not the aloe which can be helpful to those with digestion/absorption issues when taking Omega Rx.

thanks - I only had digestion issues last week and they were minor, so I'll probably try the cheaper route, for now.

Getting back to those sick and aging mice, if they'd only had a little Sea Health Plus they'd be feeling great. :D

Hello again

I'm happy this thread has sparked so much discussion. I want to go back to what tech support said about Dr. Sears' polyphenol recommendation.

What you've explained makes sense. However, I'm interested in the actual scientific verification of the idea that polyphenol supplementation can prevent or greatly reduce membrane lipid oxidation. Can you point me to any studies?

I read A LOT about health and Dr. Sears' claims about fish oil and omega-6/ AA all seem correct. He must've gotten scared off by the public's uppity attitude towards my fave, the Soy Zone, because he no longer talks down meat or talks up a vegetarian or near-vegetarian diet. Too bad. I learned today on many internet sites that AA only comes from animal sources, unfortunatley including fish and seafood. I do (now) eat seafood. But the internet says catfish and tilapia are both too low in omega-3 to justify eating such a high AA fish! I wish he'd hit that fact home more...only animal sources are direct sources of AA.

Perhaps the fish oil used in the study was from fish that contained toxins/pollutnats and/or had the wrong ratio of AA/EPA! Or the stuff oxidized abd the poor mice didn't have enough antioxidant-foods to fight the oxidation.

By the way, one huge US health agency does recommend an omega-6 to omega-3 ration of either 3:1 or 2:1!

This is in response to animal meats being high in AA, omega-6s, etc.

Fish ... fishes? aren't animals. So can't consider them "meat" I Don't think.

I don't know about fish in general, but, I looked up pollock, which I eat a lot of, and it's only 18 mg of omega-6s for almost 40 grams of protein, so, very low in 6s.

http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts...cts/4091/2

So you can just use nutritiondata.com and look up various fish and find out how much 6s it contains.

Alexy

I don't know about that 3 to 1 or 2 to 1 Omega 6 to Omega 3 ratio. I was able to get my ratio to about 2 to 1 when I was taking 12 OmegaRX fish oil capsules and really limiting my omega 6 by eating mostly macadamia nuts (which have close to 0 omega 6) as my fat. That's how hard it is to get the ratio down. I doubt if very many people actually take the time to check what their 6/3 ratio is, but eating to the recommended ratio is what caused my AA to become too low. That's why I'm not sold on the validity of the ratio, even though I've seen Dr. Sears mention that a 2 to 1 or even 1 to 1 ratio is ideal. I think the best thing to do is to just to eat the favorable fats and forget about ratios. that's what I'm doing now.

Sarah - the omega 6 in all meat and fish is very low and not a concern. The AA in the fat of meat is what we need to watch out for. that's why Zoners only eat lean meat.

Hi Larry,

Thanks ... actually, I don't eat meat much anymore. Too expensive. Well, grass-fed steak once a month or so. So ....

But, I eat a LOT of almond ground ... it's my go-to snack these days when binging. Or cocount flakes, which have almost no 6s.

I'll have to look up almond soon ...

It does sound tough to get the ratio down ... :-) And, I'm glad you're sharing your experiences here by the way ... it helps me to look at my diet a bit better I think ...

A