Hey White Light, I don’t see the extra 2 g of fat (Saturated, Omega-6, Monounsaturated and Cholesterol) having any significant impact on the average diet. Don’t get me wrong, I agree that the SYW is a better oil. Is it worth paying double for the same overall amount of EPA/DHA? Well, that’s a decision everyone has to make on his or her own. Passing IFOS standards is good enough for me. But to each its own. :wink: [quote:d09dc5ada1="White Light"]Hi Arisen. The product you are using is 30% good heart healthy fat Any idea what the other 70% is ? An ultra refined CONCENTRATE would be a better choice White Light [/quote:d09dc5ada1]

Hi arisen, On the average diet IMO an extra 2g Sat fat and cholesterol is very significant on a DAILY basis. but certainly for someone on a LOW saturated fat diet 2g may in fact be a good thing. We agree to each their own, I can think of far nicer choices for my very limited saturated fat intake, than having it as a by product of my supplimentation. BTW The source i quoted you is far more cost effective on EPA DHA on my figures. Why pay RETAIL ? White Light [quote:61942ae35e="arisen"]Hey White Light, I don’t see the extra 2 g of fat (Saturated, Omega-6, Monounsaturated and Cholesterol) having any significant impact on the average diet. Don’t get me wrong, I agree that the SYW is a better oil. Is it worth paying double for the same overall amount of EPA/DHA? Well, that’s a decision everyone has to make on his or her own. Passing IFOS standards is good enough for me. But to each its own. :wink: [quote:61942ae35e="White Light"]Hi Arisen. The product you are using is 30% good heart healthy fat Any idea what the other 70% is ? An ultra refined CONCENTRATE would be a better choice White Light [/quote:61942ae35e][/quote:61942ae35e]

I think that's were we might have a misunderstanding. From what I see with the Omega-Midwest SYW you get about 2.5 g of EPA+DHA per USD, but with the NutraSea you get 4.1 g per USD. As they both passed IFOS; shouldn’t a person on a budget (like me :) ) go for the better value? Am I missing something? [quote:4c4e4305bd="White Light"]BTW The source i quoted you is far more cost effective on EPA DHA on my figures. Why pay RETAIL ? [/quote:4c4e4305bd]

[quote:60f85f3f89="arisen"]I think that's were we might have a misunderstanding. From what I see with the Omega-Midwest SYW you get about 2.5 g of EPA+DHA per USD, but with the NutraSea you get 4.1 g per USD. As they both passed IFOS; shouldn’t a person on a budget (like me :) ) go for the better value? Am I missing something? [quote:60f85f3f89="White Light"]BTW The source i quoted you is far more cost effective on EPA DHA on my figures. Why pay RETAIL ? [/quote:60f85f3f89][/quote:60f85f3f89] For the See Yourself Well product, capsules, for example: You get 400/200 EPA/DHA per capsule. That's 600 g per 1,000 g or 60%. With the NutraSea you get 200/125 EPA/DHA per capsule. That's 325 g per ??? NutraSea doesn't diplay the total g of each capsule. So you'd have to get that information to compare. If it's not 60%, then it has more impurities. Have a look at RX Omega-3 by Natural Factors, available at iHerb.com. It is 60% (400/200) and at $15.00 per 120 casules, a good value. Free Shipping for orders over $20.00 USD/USA. Don't know about S+H to Canada. and where does WL come up with synthetic...

There are other things to consider; read this article about bioavailability: [url]http://www.ascentahealth.com/Health...;/url] It's interesting, I don't know if it's true, of course you'd expect them to toot their own horn, but they do back it up with some references.

The impaired hydrolysis of ethyl esters is well recognized. Just curious, arisen, the store sells 500ml for $29 CDN but on-line from Ascenta its $39? My math for comparative purposes is a bit different. 500ml*30% concentrate=150ml = 72g* EPA/DHA/$23.20** = 3.1g per USD (using Ascentas price (39CDN/31USD) = 2.3g per USD) *150ml * 2.4g/5ml = 72g **local store price of 29CDN = 23.20USD (1.2502 May4 Xrate)

[quote:bc8a5e7494="Scott"]The impaired hydrolysis of ethyl esters is well recognized.[/quote:bc8a5e7494]Aren’t the SYW and OmegaRX molecularly distilled, hence synthetic ethyl esters, as the article claims? [quote:bc8a5e7494="Scott"]Just curious, arisen, the store sells 500ml for $29 CDN but on-line from Ascenta its $39?[/quote:bc8a5e7494]Yes correct. Well, $29.99 actually :D [quote:bc8a5e7494="Scott"] My math for comparative purposes is a bit different. 500ml*30% concentrate=150ml = 72g* EPA/DHA/$23.20** = 3.1g per USD (using Ascentas price (39CDN/31USD) = 2.3g per USD) *150ml * 2.4g/5ml = 72g **local store price of 29CDN = 23.20USD (1.2502 May4 Xrate)[/quote:bc8a5e7494]Here are my calculations: [size=10:bc8a5e7494]Label claims: EPA 800mg and DHA 500mg for 5 mL serving, so: 1.3g EPA+DHA per serving * 100 servings (500mL bottle) = 130g per bottle at 39 CND or 31 USD divided comes to 4.2 g per USD[/size:bc8a5e7494] Your math is good, but where did you get the [b:bc8a5e7494]30%[/b:bc8a5e7494] and [b:bc8a5e7494]2.4g/5ml[/b:bc8a5e7494] figures?

[quote:e50bc76435="arisen"]Aren’t the SYW and OmegaRX molecularly distilled, hence synthetic ethyl esters, as the article claims?[/quote:e50bc76435] To produce a concentrated fish oil it must be ethylated. Some brands, like SYW are then re-esterified back into a triglyceride. [quote:e50bc76435="arisen"]]Here are my calculations: [size=10:e50bc76435]Label claims: EPA 800mg and DHA 500mg for 5 mL serving, so: 1.3g EPA+DHA per serving * 100 servings (500mL bottle) = 130g per bottle at 39 CND or 31 USD divided comes to 4.2 g per USD[/size:e50bc76435] Your math is good, but where did you get the [b:e50bc76435]30%[/b:e50bc76435] and [b:e50bc76435]2.4g/5ml[/b:e50bc76435] figures?[/quote:e50bc76435] SInce Nutrasea is 30% EPA and DHA, I came up with 150ml of EPA/DHA per bottle (500*30%). I then converted the EPA/DHA to grams. But it appears I may have cut the concentration in half twice :oops:

HI John, .[quote:f975a8c5c5] Have a look at RX Omega-3 by Natural Factors, available at iHerb.com. Don't know about S+H to Canada.[/quote:f975a8c5c5] S & H to Canada is irelevant. Synthetic supliments are ilegal there so your "cheap substitute" does not cut the mustard! White Light

Hi Arisen, I checked your figures and can confirn that "yours" is the most cost effective certified product on the market so far, for long chain Omega 3's However IMO most people would prefer to pay a little more for a better product. Reasons. 1 "yours" is in liquid form so will be Rancid within 28 days of opening. Given that they sell 100 servings at a time 72% of it will be wasted unless more than 1 person is simultainiously takeing it. 2 The Cholesterol in this product is at such a high level that The blood profile of any user will deteriorate. 3 that saturated fat content is so high that it will cause weight gain rather than the weight loss, as a concentrate would produce. But, as we agree, to each their own. White Light [quote:6c30f3a45e="arisen"][quote:6c30f3a45e="Scott"]The impaired hydrolysis of ethyl esters is well recognized.[/quote:6c30f3a45e]Aren’t the SYW and OmegaRX molecularly distilled, hence synthetic ethyl esters, as the article claims? [quote:6c30f3a45e="Scott"]Just curious, arisen, the store sells 500ml for $29 CDN but on-line from Ascenta its $39?[/quote:6c30f3a45e]Yes correct. Well, $29.99 actually :D [quote:6c30f3a45e="Scott"] My math for comparative purposes is a bit different. 500ml*30% concentrate=150ml = 72g* EPA/DHA/$23.20** = 3.1g per USD (using Ascentas price (39CDN/31USD) = 2.3g per USD) *150ml * 2.4g/5ml = 72g **local store price of 29CDN = 23.20USD (1.2502 May4 Xrate)[/quote:6c30f3a45e]Here are my calculations: [size=10:6c30f3a45e]Label claims: EPA 800mg and DHA 500mg for 5 mL serving, so: 1.3g EPA+DHA per serving * 100 servings (500mL bottle) = 130g per bottle at 39 CND or 31 USD divided comes to 4.2 g per USD[/size:6c30f3a45e] Your math is good, but where did you get the [b:6c30f3a45e]30%[/b:6c30f3a45e] and [b:6c30f3a45e]2.4g/5ml[/b:6c30f3a45e] figures?[/quote:6c30f3a45e]

This is all so confusing. So many specifications to consider! I've been reading the forums and trying to decide on the best as well as a cost effective fish oil I can find in Canada. Most places in the States do not ship to Canada. (the cheaper SYW I had found in the states) I decided to go with the "See Yourself Well" fish oil from Anne-Marie. She was having a special last week. For every bottle of 500mg omega 3 (240capsules) you recieve the 1000mg (90capsules) free. The only thing is that the 1000mg bottle has a drug Identification number whereas the 500mg bottle doesn't. Could they just have forgotten to state it on the bottle?

[quote:046b2e30e9="Sarah04"]This is all so confusing. So many specifications to consider! [/quote:046b2e30e9] I understand your frustration. Just choose from those here: www.ifosprogram.com

Thank you Scott! :D

[quote:2d408146e2="White Light"] However IMO most people would prefer to pay a little more for a better product. Reasons. 1 "yours" is in liquid form so will be Rancid within 28 days of opening. Given that they sell 100 servings at a time 72% of it will be wasted unless more than 1 person is simultainiously takeing it. 2 The Cholesterol in this product is at such a high level that The blood profile of any user will deteriorate. 3 that saturated fat content is so high that it will cause weight gain rather than the weight loss, as a concentrate would produce. White Light [/quote:2d408146e2] Points # 2 & 3 are simply not true. What elevates one's cholesterol level and deteriorates one's cholesterol profile is #1. elevated insulin levels and #2. a high consumption of saturated fats. The earlier stated 2 grams of extra saturated fat would not significantly impact cholesterol levels or fat gain as you say if insulin is controled through the Zone diet on a regular basis. That being said, I would still take Dr.Sears' Omega Rx Fish Oil #1 and then SYW as a second choice especially if the daily doses are not too high (i.e. 2.5g/day maintainance dose). As I have said before, I know that the reason we know so much about the benefits of FO, controlling and reducing silent inflammation and alleviating or eliminating the symptoms of so many "diseases" or ailments is because of all the research that has been done and Dr.Sears who is at the forefront of delivering this information to the masses with his great books and the daily help he provides on his websites... Because of that, because I trust that Dr.Sears has the health of the people at heart and because I believe Dr.Sears is commited to making the best products out there, I choose to buy Omega Rx. Again not trying to start anything here and discussing the different options is relevant but this is my opinion and personal situation. Pat

Thanks for you sincere comments Pat. [quote:08923c4586="itsallaboutbalance"] What elevates one's cholesterol level and deteriorates one's cholesterol profile is #1. elevated insulin levels and #2. a high consumption of saturated fats. [/quote:08923c4586] To clarify, #2 is not supported by the available evidence. The saturated fat Stearic acid (18:0) has not been shown to be hypercholesterolemic (1), and in fact may lower cholesterol because of its ability to inhibt the absorption of cholesterol (2). Palmitic (16:0) is generally believed to have cholesterol raising properties. Myristic (14:0) and Lauric acid (12:0) have shown to be hypercholesterolemic in some studies, but not all, and in those cases where cholesterol increases, HDL increases as well (3). Saturated fats with less than 12 carbons are generally believed not to raise serum cholesterol (4). But I digress... (1) Grundy SM [i:08923c4586]"Influence of stearic acid on cholesterol metabolism relative to other long-chain fatty acids"[/i:08923c4586] AJCN 1994 Dec 60(6 Suppl) (2) German JB, et al [i:08923c4586]"Saturated fats: what dietary intake?"[/i:08923c4586] AJCN 2004 Sep; 80(3)550-559 (3) Temme EH, et al [i:08923c4586]"Comparison of the effects of diets enriched in lauric, palmitic, or oleic acids on serum lipids and lipoproteins in healthy men and women" [/i:08923c4586]AJCN 1996 Jun;63(6):897-903 (4) Nicolosi RJ [i:08923c4586]"Dietary fat saturation effects on low-density-lipoprotein concentrations and metabolism in various animal models" [/i:08923c4586]AJCN May;65(5 Suppl)

And thank you for the clarification and thorough research once again ;-) Pat [quote:df1547fee6="Scott"]Thanks for you sincere comments Pat. [quote:df1547fee6="itsallaboutbalance"] What elevates one's cholesterol level and deteriorates one's cholesterol profile is #1. elevated insulin levels and #2. a high consumption of saturated fats. [/quote:df1547fee6] To clarify, #2 is not supported by the available evidence. The saturated fat Stearic acid (18:0) has not been shown to be hypercholesterolemic (1), and in fact may lower cholesterol because of its ability to inhibt the absorption of cholesterol (2). Palmitic (16:0) is generally believed to have cholesterol raising properties. Myristic (14:0) and Lauric acid (12:0) have shown to be hypercholesterolemic in some studies, but not all, and in those cases where cholesterol increases, HDL increases as well (3). Saturated fats with less than 12 carbons are generally believed not to raise serum cholesterol (4). But I digress... (1) Grundy SM [i:df1547fee6]"Influence of stearic acid on cholesterol metabolism relative to other long-chain fatty acids"[/i:df1547fee6] AJCN 1994 Dec 60(6 Suppl) (2) German JB, et al [i:df1547fee6]"Saturated fats: what dietary intake?"[/i:df1547fee6] AJCN 2004 Sep; 80(3)550-559 (3) Temme EH, et al [i:df1547fee6]"Comparison of the effects of diets enriched in lauric, palmitic, or oleic acids on serum lipids and lipoproteins in healthy men and women" [/i:df1547fee6]AJCN 1996 Jun;63(6):897-903 (4) Nicolosi RJ [i:df1547fee6]"Dietary fat saturation effects on low-density-lipoprotein concentrations and metabolism in various animal models" [/i:df1547fee6]AJCN May;65(5 Suppl)[/quote:df1547fee6]

Still, fact is that15mg of cholesterol, is a very small amount that will not make a difference in anyone’s diet, much less deteriorate the “blood profile”. The same with 2g of saturated fat (although a bit more significant then cholesterol). Also oil in liquid form can be stored in the freezer and it does not go rancid for a very long while.

Hi Arisen, A few important FACTS 2g of your health grade FO will provide 600mg of long chain omega 3 whereas Dr. Sears says you need 2400mg. If you increase the dose 4* so that you get the omega 3 you actually need, you increase the Cholesterol 4* and the Sat fat 4* Sure at 2 caps a day health grade won't do you any harm, trouble is, it won't do you any good either !. As for storing in the freezer, kindly check with the manufacturer. They will advise that refrigerator is best. Freezing oxides fish oil. White Light [quote:1a31104fbc="arisen"]Still, fact is that15mg of cholesterol, is a very small amount that will not make a difference in anyone’s diet, much less deteriorate the “blood profile”. The same with 2g of saturated fat (although a bit more significant then cholesterol). Also oil in liquid form can be stored in the freezer and it does not go rancid for a very long while.[/quote:1a31104fbc]

[quote:677027694f="White Light"]HI John, .[quote:677027694f] Have a look at RX Omega-3 by Natural Factors, available at iHerb.com. Don't know about S+H to Canada.[/quote:677027694f] S & H to Canada is irelevant. Synthetic supliments are ilegal there so your "cheap substitute" does not cut the mustard! White Light[/quote:677027694f] 1.) Why are you so negative and always putting down others. This is supposed to be a postive experience for users. Your tone is unappreciated. 2.) R U saying synthetic, because it is ethyl ester? So then is Dr. Sears. So you are saying that his is expensive synthetic which does not cut the mustard!

Hi Jay ![quote:b3b72632b2] 1.) Why are you so negative and always putting down others. This is supposed to be a postive experience for users. Your tone is unappreciated. 2.) R U saying synthetic, because it is ethyl ester? So then is Dr. Sears. So you are saying that his is expensive synthetic which does not cut the mustard![/quote:b3b72632b2] 1 This is just YOUR perception. I am all for this being a positive experience for users. However, you recommended an illegal product from a company willing to flout the law. End result - when the product gets confiscated the customer has a very NEGATIVE experience. 2 Yes ethyl ester is synthetic. That's what I did say. The Sears product while being ethyl ester has proven positive benefits. However, the good people at Dr. Sears respect the law, and do not attemt to sell it illegally in Canada. White Light

Dubya-L doesn't need me to defend him, but I can attest he has always been unbelievable positive and helpful in the face of antagonism and derision. And not just mine. :wink: As for finding quality PGFO in Canada at the best price, including S&H, there is no source better than [url]www.pgfo.com[/url] . For those south of 49th parallel there is [url]http://www.omega-midwest.com[/url] . Both companies ship to both countries. As for Canada's import restrictions being "silly" compared to those of the States, let's talk about that some night over a Havana cigar.

[quote:e59e28d30b="White Light"]Why pay RETAIL ?[/quote:e59e28d30b] Retail is for suckers! 8)

I use RXOmega-3 Factors. It comes from Canada and I can buy it at Vitamin Cottage in Colorado.

56 Capsules @ $19.88 Each Capsule 1000.0 mg TOTAL OMEGA-3 FATTY ACIDS 600.0 mg EPA (EICOSAPENTAENOIC ACID) 280.0 mg DHA (DOCOSAHEXAENOIC ACID) 235.0 mg 1.) Dr. Sears recommends a 60% Omega 3 with a 40/20 split EPA/DHA These are not 40/20. 2.) 280 + 235 = 515. What are the remaining 85 mg of Omega 3? 3.) 56 Capsules @ $19.88 compare to ..... Natural Factors of 120 Capsules @ $16.00. (or even the more costly See Your Self Well - is still cheaper than these.)

Hi John, I don't know about the remaining 85 mg of Omega 3 but I'll try to find out. Meanwhile, as you know, everyone has their own recommendations about everything under the sun. Personally, I chose to go with the advice of and products made by a renowned scientist who grew up to 40 billion human cells every day for over 25 years keeping them completely healthy by bathing them in a "nutritional soup" he developd that provided them with all the nutrients they required to be nourished and protected so they could carry out their intended functions. He also developed (and set the worldwide "gold standard" for developing) infectious disease tests and assays, over 30 of them used in 35 countries worldwide. In addition, the EFA oil and Fish Oil supplements are not farmed out to someone else to make or slap a private label on. He manufactures them in his own FDA registered facility according to Pharmaceutical Grade cGMPs, the strictest standard, far more so than Food Grade GMPs which most supplements are manufactured according to. The fish oil supplements are "double distilled" to assure all impurities are removed, such as mercury, arsenic, lead, cadmium, toxins, etc. Take care, Michael 1.) Dr. Sears recommends a 60% Omega 3 with a 40/20 split EPA/DHA These are not 40/20. 2.) 280 + 235 = 515. What are the remaining 85 mg of Omega 3? 3.) 56 Capsules @ $19.88 compare to ..... Natural Factors of 120 Capsules @ $16.00. (or even the more costly See Your Self Well - is still cheaper than these.) _________________ ><> ----- <>< ~john d. p. Col. 3:23-24 http://www.pilla.name <>< -------------------- ><>